Advice needed on best small length rod for local streams.

[ideaman1138]

So far I only have a 9' 5wt that I have used mostly on bigger water. I want to do more small/skinny water fishing on the San Gabriel and similar rivers and creeks. I would like to get a shorter rod to better navigate the sometimes thick underbrush and hopefully reduce hangups when casting. I haven't fished with anything but a 9' 5wt. How short and light would you recommend for these waters? How different will the casting be? Right now I am just flicking the leader into these small pools anyway. I am considering anything from a 7'6" 3wt down to the 5' 2wt. But I would consider anything in between. (5',6',7'-2 or 3 wt) Thanks for any advice.

[fflutterffly]

I've got a nice little 6' 2wt I love in the small streams with nice tip action. I can Bow and Arrow that line into most any tiny hole. I'm sure one of the guys on this website can build you a little stream rod. Stanbery built a 2wt for karen and it is beautiful

[hpskiff]

I fish the SGR several times a month and have really never needed anything other than my 8'6" 5wt. at least on the west fork, but the short rods are sure fun. On the other forks and other locals I really find the short rods a big help. I just moved up to my third and most expensive one.

My first was/is a Bass Pro Dogwood Canyon 7' 4wt. 2pc. Which was purchased based on it's low cost to get my feet wet. I wound up using it for almost ten years and have caught more fish on it than any other rod. (They were on sale a couple weeks ago for under $40 and the package is around $100.) It is a little stiff, but does pretty well especially if you put some better line on it. I have a reel with a 3wt. orvis superfine line and have used it on all three of my small stream rods. If you get this one check the blank carefully. I was going to pick one up at the sale, but the only 7 footer in stock had a big lump in it.

Next I purchased my daughter a Diamondback All-American 6' 3wt. 2pc. Mainly because she was 6 at the time and I wanted a light rod balanced for her. The lifetime warranty was a plus especially since I broke it twice (Yes me, not the 6 year old). She used it for a while but got interested in other things, so I started using it. It has a very soft action for graphite and casts beautifully, however it's range is a bit limited as it runs out of backbone at about 35 ft. Unfortunately it is no longer made and the company(Cortland owned) seems to have an uncertain future, which stopped me from getting their diamondglass series rod.

Just a week ago I invested in Orvis's new 6'6" 3wt. Superfine Touch. I decided on the 3 because it had a better feel than the 2wt. and handles wind and slighty longer casts much better. I have only fished it once but have cast it in the park a lot. I really wanted the hassle free warranty and a 4 piece rod because I plan to fish some really rough spots with it.

I looked into Cabela's new anniversary glass rod. At $100 it was very tempting, but I was unsure has slow the glass would cast and how durable it would be. Also I think I saw a nice little rod in the Fisherman's Spot booth at the Pasadena show, so you might give them a call too.

On a final note, if cost is no concern a little bamboo rod would be awesome. Flybob had one at the get-together last week that was truly a thing of beauty, but not in the cards for me anytime soon.

Hope that helps a little, and if you want to meet up sometime I can let you try all three.

Mitchell

[fflutterffly]

HP I loved my Supperfine (Original model) and would give anything to get it back. It went into a big deep hole in the Owens many years ago. One of the best roll casting rods I'd used and perfect for my style. I think that 6.6. is the right size for all small streams.

I wish some of our expert SmS fisherman, like creek and doc would pipe in, since they do a bit of this back country dipping.

[WanderingBlues]

I have a TFO 6' 2wt that works OK and cost me $89.00. I spooled it with 3wt line, though, because when the water does open up, it is a bear to cast if you match the line. Overall, I use a 7'6" 3wt for the locals 90% of the time and it performs in nearly all situations.

The best way to figure it out is to invite the guys to bring their creekin' rods for a day on the water. Ply them with a variety of good pale ales and cigars, and you can test what the options are!

And by the way, welcome to FFA.

[buggravy]

I 2nd (or maybe it's 3rd) the 7'6" 3wt recommendation. I've got an SLT that I bought 5 or so years ago, and it has seen exponentially more action than any other rod in my quiver. I like using smaller weights at times locally, but for a quiver of 1, I think the 7'6" 3 would definitely cover all your bases.

[RichardCullip]

I love my 7'10" Sage TXL 00wt rod for small streams. It's light enough that it makes the small trout fun but has enough backbone to cast 30-40ft (if you happen to find a casting lane) and land big trout (biggest so far on it was an 18" cutt from Grand Tetons NP). Before dropping the big bucks on this small rod, I used a TFO Series 1 7'6" 3wt that cost me $89. This rod is still in my quiver but it doesn't see much use anymore.

[rayfound]

I tried a 6'6" rod and hated it. I like my 7'6" 3wt, and LOVE my 7'10" 00wt.

If there isn't a lot of casting room, you will do more flipping, high sticking, and lifting... a 7'6"-8' rod is better for that(than a shorter rod), and seems to be the sweet spot for me before it gets unwieldy on tight streams. I have an 8'9" 3wt at all and its terrible on small creeks IMO... its just too long.

I think of the short rods(sub 7') more as small stream casting rods... good on streams where you have an overhead canopy or something and a 9 footer would be too big, but where the normal cast would be 25-40 feet... not the 8-18 feet of my small creek fishing.

And I think its almost impossible to make a nice delicate, accurate, presentation of a fly at 15' with a rod much heavier than a 3wt. Maybe a glass or bamboo 4 wt would do nicely too.

[midger]

You have to determine for yourself what type rod you prefer. Some like fast rods, some like the slow rods.

Like Ray, I'm also not thrilled with the sub 7' rods for anything. I had a 6'6" rod and considered it more of a toy than an actual, functional flyrod. I prefer longer rods as IMHO they are much more useful for a broader range of conditions. I also prefer a 4 or 6 piece rod for transportability and ease of breakdown and carrying rigged (with reel attached) in a carrier which is hard to do with an odd-numbered piece rod (like a 3 or 5 piece).

My local rod is a 7'9" 3 weight, 2 piece. I don't travel with it so number of pieces isn't a concern here, although if this blank was made in a 4 piece, I'd definitely switch and build one up, as again, I like the portability of the 4/6 piece rods.

You've received good input, but you need to define your price point. The Sage SLT/ZXL series are pricey. So is the TXL in 000-3 weight. Great rods but do you want to spend that much? Also the TXL is a 3 piece, which for me is not an optimal configuration. The SLT can be had in 4 piece which is a plus. You can find rods by other makers though that would meet your criteria--ie TFO Finesse, 7'9" 4 piece 3 weight, Cabelas Stowaway 6 piece in a 3 weight, plus a plethora of other rods.

Here's one you may want to consider. I don't own one but it sure looks like a nice, cheaper sage rod:
http://www.sageflyfish.com/dyn_prodlist.php?k=299018


CAST< CAST< CAST. Fish with folks who have rods they'll let you try out. You'll find one that you like.

[FlyinFish]

With my limited experience, I'm more of the same - 7' is just too short, 7'6" works awesome, but 60% of the time I wish I had another 3 or 6 inches. I think a 7'9" would be perfect, but at other times I love that it's a 7'6". It's a tough call, but for the way I fish, I'd prefer a 7'9" or 7'10".

BTW, that's all on a 2wt. A 3wt is probably a much better all around rod, but for a short local water rod, I'd prefer less than 3wt.

I also take my 2wt and throw on open waters like the Owens. That's when I really wish I had a longer 3wt, but it really isn't THAT bad. Yet another reason I'd prefer a 7'9".

You may say I'm crazy to split hairs over 3", but it all adds up when you're trying to bushwhack through our locals.

As for brands, well, the Sage TXL is at a reasonable clearance price if you can find one. Rainshadow makes some nice blanks that aren't too expensive if you want to build one. TFO has a great 7'9" 3wt in one of there middle of the road series. And the Echo 2 7'8" 3wt would be my top choice if I was in the market right now. I have the Wright & McGill 7'6" 2 wt. That and the Echo 2 are top notch rods and very reasonable prices compared to what else is out there. But then again, the TXLs are on clearance now, so all three of those are at the same price point and are of equivalent awesomeness.

The W&M does come in a 5 pc and as much as I always say I don't care much about how many pieces it is, it is * nice to have a rod that packs away so small, even for just carrying it around in the car and apartment.

It's all personal preference and depends on how you fish and cast and what you expect it to do. A 7'6" - 7'10" 2wt or 3wt will be the best in my opinion. Anything shorter could be a lot of fun, but would not be very versatile. Especially if you've only got a 5wt, you may want something more versatile. Then later you can get more toys.

[1mocast]

How short and light would you recommend for these waters?

I would recommend going into your local flyshop and try casting different rods. Try some Sidearm Casting, Backhand sidearm, and B&A. My personal preference is a 7 1/2 ft. 3wt.

How different will the casting be?

Realize that Not all 3wt rods are true 3 wt.!!!!! This applies to all rods. For instance, I can tape over all the Manufacturer labels on a dozen 7 1/2 3wt rods and have 3 wt line loaded on it. You would swear some of them are 2 wt and some 4wt. The ones closer to a 2 wt are perfect for dry fly fishing, the ones closer to a 4 wt are better suited for a heavy weighted flies or windy days. For the Frugalistas like myself, the Cabela's 7 1/2 3wt Three Forks is a steal at $50 on sale (My first fly rod and still one of my "Goto" rods, Not lifetime warrantee though). It is closer to a 4 wt. The TFO Pro Series has a pretty soft tip and pretty sweet in that size. Try some of the Sage TXL, Orvis superfine, or Winstons and you will "Feel" the difference...

Bottom line, go to your local shop, cast and compare them. Buy the one that feels right...

[Flyjunkie]

A Very cool trick i learned from Lefty Kreh back in the 1980s is this :

You've only got an 8 or 9 ft. rod and you are fishing a creek that is small and in some areas bushy You are having a hard time in some spots because the length of the rod is a bit too much. no worries, you can magically make the rod Shorter, here's how:

Allow Your Rod hand to slide up the Rod to slightly below the Stripper Guide, hold the rod there, keep the handle against your Fore arm just at the elbow and go about your Cast.

By this simple "slide of hand" you've shortened the overall length by almost 2 feet. It is somewhat awkward in that the butt section is hanging below your Rod hand, but on Small creeks, where you are not casting all that far, it will work very well in a Pinch.

But since we have plenty of Small creeks around here, and plenty of bushy creeks in the Sierra, you should certainly buy yourself a shorter, Lighter line weight rod... But this little Trick comes in handy even with shorter rods....

My Small creek baby??? = Winston Boron 2T 71/2 ft; 3wt.. lighter then most OO ~ 2 wts. and a little gem to cast, fish and fight the Small Creek trout with....

[nick562]

6''6 3wt or 4 wt that is all I have to say or listen to what Flyjunkie said if its coming from Lefty Kreh. Those short small wt fly rod can be expensive as heck.

[DubL HauL]

do not feed the trolls

Andy

[ideaman1138]

Thank you all for the input. It is much appreciated. It looks like the majority are recommending a 7' 6" - 3wt which is what I was considering earlier. I will try to cast a few options before buying and be bush-whacking in no time.