Light Weight Shooting Head?

[WanderingBlues]

This July, a buddy is coming out from South Africa with a bucket list goal of catching a Golden. Realizing that the moving water opportunities are limited, we may concentrate on lakes within day hike distance.

I'll probably pack two 3 wt rods- the 6'9" glass for dry flies, and the 9' for small streamers. I was thinking about building a shooting head for the Sage One, which is more a 3/4 wt. Should I cut down a 5 wt intermediate with a running line, or go down to 4 wt? I'm thinking shooting head only to insure getting past the ledges on the lakes I'm thinking of, and to insure I get the fly deep quickly.

What say you?

[BrownBear]

I haven't tried it with the Sage One, but I've used a lot of heads on lighter rods. My inclination in your situation would be to go with the cut 5WT, clipping from the back end of the head a little at a time as needed until you get the loading you want.

A bigger issue may be your running line. In my experience if it's not just right, you won't gain much over using the conventional 5WF line. My pick of the litter is PLine CFX Fluorocarbon Leader in 12#, or 15# if the 12 makes you nervous. It gives just the right mix of stiffness, small diameter and slickness. I haven't tried their newer Shinsei Leader Material for running line, but I'm guessing it would be great too. Their CXX Leader is slightly softer, and I'd be more inclined to go with 15# with that in spite of the little larger diameter than 12#, just to add a little stiffness.

Sounds like a really fun trip. Get some!

[NorcalBob]

Whilst I'm no expert on wimpy weight shooting heads , all of my shooting heads for "normal" rods are uplined at least two line weights. So for a 3wt rod, I'd be starting with a 5 wt line. I'd test cast a few line wt combo's before I start cutting up lines. But then again, the lightest weight rod I fling shooting heads on is a 6 wt, so I may just be all wet!

[RichardCullip]

In mild summer conditions at the beach (no wind, small surf) I love using my 4wt. I've got it loaded up with SA 150gr Wet-tip Express. This is a fairly fast sinking 25ft integrated shooting head style of line. The combo works great until the wind comes up or the surf gets big.

Like NorcalBob, I was taught that you upline by 2 rod weights when using a shooting head and the heads should be btwn 25ft and 30ft long. Anything shorter and the cast tends to dump. Anything longer and it's hard to control (at least for my casting abilities) the line in the air.

[briansII]

How far do you think you need to cast, to make it beyond the ledge? This is a critical piece to finding a solution.

I agree with the others. Thin, slick, low memory, mono, shooting line. There are some specific monofilament shooting lines(Frog Hair, Amnesia, Varivas etc), or just fishing lines. I like Suffix Elite or Siege. Start with a 5wt head, and adjust as needed. To get the most out of this setup, you'll need to change your casting technique.

OR

Pack a lightweight float tube. That would be my solution.

briansII

[fly addict]

You might try a Wulff Triangle Taper. They shoot very well and also will work for other standard fishing needs; they make an intermediate and full sink and a sink tip. Personally I think a 3 wt is way too small to cast a sinking line and streamers, but I don’t know a thing about casting. Over loading a rod with a heaver weight fly line is a good way to break a rod. And this is how it can happen; a 3 wt rod with a 5 wt line, casting at 40’ would be like casting a 7 wt line, at 45’ it would be more like an 8wt line. Here is the link to the website, http://royalwulff.com/products/triangle ... -fly-line/

[tenandtwo]

I bought a spool of amnesia and rio t-14 for my 8 wt and have been messing around with it here and there in the surf, bay, and lakes on and off for about a year. This is my first setup and when I do it just right I can cast almost twice as far as with regular fly line. ( of course when it does not go right it is a mess.. ) but yeah right away I planned on using it in the Sierra lakes even though it is overkill for small trout. It will launch streamers much farther and drop them quick. Curious to the feedback because I would be interested in a trout size setup that will do the same.

[WanderingBlues]

See, this is why I posed this question. I may need to hit as much as 80' to hit some of the ledges. I fished a 6wt shooting head up at the P and really enjoyed it. I've seen some shooting head chatter on ULflyfishing.com, and wondered about it. Thanks thus far.

[anacrime]

I would go with one of those 10ft sink tips from Rio. You can buy em in pretty much any fly shop. I don't think you need a shooting head for distance purposes. I can pretty much cast my whole line, flora permitting, on my 4wt with the Rio tip. Usually have plenty of space for a double haul on those lakes above treeline...

[midger]

Trying to throw a shooting head with a three weight rod to me is like trying to frame a house using a small ball peen hammer instead of a heavier framing hammer. Yeah, it can probably be done, but it certainly isn't the right tool for the job.

The smallest sink tip line I own is a 4 weight, and honestly it has only been used one time. I prefer using a 5 weight or above if I'm throwing larger streamers with sink tips or shooting heads (which I really don't care for that much).

I think the recommendation for a float tube was a good one, or just wade out to nearer the ledge/drop off and cast shorter distances if you are using 3 weight rods.

Just my .02

[silverlaker]

This sounds like an interesting experiment. There are some good suggestions already. Honestly I would do the float tube or take a heaver rod, as suggested by others. I'll send you a PM with a few moving water options.

[fly addict]

I should clarify my last post; you will not continue to overload the rod with a shooting head and mono running line. The mono line does not add much weight to the cast like a normal flyline would as you continue to increase your casting distance. A mono running line does create a few problems though. It can tangle very easy, and you may want to use a stripping basket. You’ll need to strip all of the mono line back to the rod before you start your cast and then shoot the rest to your target. You mention that you may need to cast up to 80’, even with a 40’ shooting head (and I don’t think that length would work very well on a 3wt) you would need to shoot 40’ to get to 80’. And if you’re dealing with any wind it could be way over the capabilities of a 3 wt. A heaver rod would make your casting to such distance much easier for you. Or have you thought about an ultra-light float tube. . And those fish that are far offshore during the midday can move into the shallow waters closer to shore in the early morning and late afternoon to feed. Fish the moving water in the middle of the day, and the lake when you might get a shot at the fish in close to shore.

[WanderingBlues]

I've been reading more to do with a 22-25 ' head for a 3wt. Maybe I'll just throw floating with a split shot and a Midger Micro-bugger.

[duckdog]

Maybe I missed it, but how deep do you need to get those flies ? I vote for bringing a float tube. I always carry straps in my float tube when I fish Crowley so that if the wind gets nasty too quickly I can walk it back. Easy shmeasy. But, Crowley is flat ground , and that is a mighty big but. I don't know the ground that you will be covering. If you think that carrying a tube would be more trouble than it's worth then I would opt for the 6 wt. If I had to only get my flies down 10 or 12 ft , maybe 14ft I would either use my 25ft 200gr. sink tip or my 30 ft sink tip. If I needed to get them deeper I would break out the full sink stuff. That's just me. I don't think that I could lay out an 80 ft cast with a 3 wt loaded w/ a sinking line and a streamer. And if I did manage to do it , doing it for a few hours seems like a ton of work. A 6 wt may make the whole experience a little more enjoyable. No matter what you decide Curtis, I hope that you have fun .

[BrownBear]

You might try a Wulff Triangle Taper. They shoot very well and also will work for other standard fishing needs; they make an intermediate and full sink and a sink tip.

I'm a sincere fan of the Triangle Tapers, but the "heads" are waaaaay too long on their smaller lines to function like shooting heads. I have the floaters in 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 WT. Some of their sinkers are shorter, but don't come as small as you may need.

A better choice is the Vibe 65 from Vision. What a great line! But hard to find a source here in the states. You can get the Vision Target line in the lighter weights, though it has a 9.6 meter head rather than a 6.5 like the Vibe 65. Their Cult line is a great line and available here, but the head is still a little long for use as a "shooting head" on lighter rods.

But here's the deal- No running line on a conventional fly line will shoot as well as mono, tangles or not. The very best line with a sinking head and "integrated" mono running lines we've found are the Rio Leviathan 26ft sink tips, but the lightest you can get are 200 grains. They sink like lead core and that running line is the best we've found for tangle-free casts and clean shooting. Amazing line for deep saltwater and lakes, but so specialized you'd probably never use it anywhere else.