EW flows

[Rockstar Fisherman]

So it goes from almost spring time flows to almost winter time flows in a week...... Man I wish I were up there catching all those bruisers off guard in that small waterthey found refuge in. Of course after 3 days of these flows so they can adjust to the flow changes.

Maybe I'm crazy but it makes sense to me

BTW how did the UO jump to 100???

[fly addict]

Mike,
The guys who control the flows have no idea what kinda pressure they put on the fish when they do major flow changes like that. Right now the browns are spawning and Im sure some disruption of the spawn will happen. Only in California do they get away with that kinda of stupid water management!

With the low flows that they have now, most of the trout will be pooled up in small holes. Which means the flyfisherman will also be more on top of each other then they already are!

Mark

[duckdog]

although i am no biologist[ but i did stay at a holiday inn last night, no really, i did] it seems to me that droping the flows to such a low level so quickly is not only tough on the fish , but just hammers the insect population. all those aquatic invertibrates left high and dry. i fished hotcreek yesterday, it was great, fish rising everywhere to emerging bwo's and my dog barking her head off ! when ever i would start casting she would just go berserk, now it could be that she was just criticizing my casting but it quickly worked on my last nerve, in short , i wanted to kill her,but there would have been too many witness's so after about 40 min. we just left. fish rising EVERYWHERE. she has a bark collar in her imediate future! i did get two nice bows on a 22 bwo floating nymph. could have been an epic day,oh well, she did find a bunch of quail the day before, shorthair's giveth and shorthairs taketh away.

[dharris1969]

While talking with a local (buddy of mine), said the water flows were raised due to not being able to legally store the water. Water flows are controlled by law for irrigation throughout the summer growing season.

[Rockstar Fisherman]

Mike,
The guys who control the flows have no idea what kinda pressure they put on the fish when they do major flow changes like that. Right now the browns are spawning and Im sure some disruption of the spawn will happen.

Mark

Good point Mark

[dharris1969]

Mike,
The guys who control the flows have no idea what kinda pressure they put on the fish when they do major flow changes like that. Right now the browns are spawning and Im sure some disruption of the spawn will happen.

Mark

Good point Mark

When you think about, most tail water systems have this same issue. People who dam water for irrigation and consumption are really only taking into consideration for the masses, not fish. I believe there should be a limit of how and when.
I did not see allot of spawning beds, but did see a couple. Mentioned to another angler and he thought I was making it up. I told him he was standing right next to a freshly cleared area for the spawn. His reply "how do you know that is what did that. I just walked away at that point... I also told a guy fishing with double treble hook rapala's on Sunday that he was now poaching and can't use that particular method. He did not realize the month had changed and actually thanked me. I have never got a response from a bait or lure chuck-er like that.

[209er]

Hey Mark,
Life isn't as simple as you want it. Do you eat? What ever you eat needs water too! What is the first thing you do after fishing all day? Ok, after the beer or Crown? (made from water too)Yes, eat. We are at the end of the assembly line so take it like an informed man. That dam was put there not for tailwater fishing to satisfy YOU but to water stock and grow alfalfa for our beef and lamb and to provide summer long water to landowners downstream. Believe me, if it wasn't dammed, those browns would cook in July/August, if there were any left! So, next time someone wants to eliminate a dam, think of the consequences or pluses. Pluses are for steelhead and salmon only. Yes, anacrime, I've had my martini. Let's go fishing. 09er

[209er]

Hey all,
As a footnote to dharris' statement, laws NOW include minimum flows for wildlife and flora, something that was lacking in the 20s, 30s, and 40s and even into the 70s. Think about it, it was all ag related. We're not perfect although Randy and I thought so. Now we're into 2009 and just recently the water gods were forced to allow more fall and winter flows so we can have genetically inferior steelhead and salmon runs on the San Joaquin. Hey, these pre-dam fish had to endure 70 plus water temps and low flows and these new inhabitants won't cut it. Wait til the salmon try to spawn and I'm sure you know what happens. The owners of these fancy homes above the river won't like the stench of decaying fish. This additional water comes from OUR(you and me) water supply, so expect higher produce and beef prices soon. Isn't life cherry? Thrash me, let's see if you know what you thought you knew you were talking about. Yeah, I know I'm an * but hey, somebody has to pop your bubble! 09er

[rickster]

Well, that shut 'em up... r
Let's go to Baja '09er

[fly addict]

Hey Mark,
Life isn't as simple as you want it. Do you eat? What ever you eat needs water too! What is the first thing you do after fishing all day? Ok, after the beer or Crown? (made from water too)Yes, eat. We are at the end of the assembly line so take it like an informed man. That dam was put there not for tailwater fishing to satisfy YOU but to water stock and grow alfalfa for our beef and lamb and to provide summer long water to landowners downstream. Believe me, if it wasn't dammed, those browns would cook in July/August, if there were any left! So, next time someone wants to eliminate a dam, think of the consequences or pluses. Pluses are for steelhead and salmon only. Yes, anacrime, I've had my martini. Let's go fishing. 09er

09er,
Do I eat! That is a stupid question! Something that maybe an rich arrogant farmer or a drunken moron would ask. That’s the kind of attitude that has nearly wiped out our salmon and other fishery’s in California. Its time that the wildlife in our state has some representation in the discussions about water uses before it is too late. If most existing dams in this state were being built today, all uses including the fish and fishing would have to be taken into account before the dam would be approved. Water stored in a reservoir is not just for farmers who get it a below market value at taxpayers and other users expense. I don’t know about the dam at Bridgeport but the government with taxpayer money built most other dams in this country. That means all other users and I should have a voice about how that water is used. Not just the landowners downstream to grow alfalfa and cows.
I have no problem with paying more for food and other items if it means that the fisheries and other wildlife in this state are protected from being left high and dry. Maybe you forgot, but the Bridgeport water Management Company was sued for creating a massive fish die off because of lack of water down stream from Bridgeport dam. And that was with a dam in place. I think that with your attitude you might want to take up some other sport. Because of your idiot statements it is obvious that you not interested in a healthy trout, salmon or steelhead fishery in this state. And I think most people on this board will agree with me.
Mark

[gabe]

Mike,
The guys who control the flows have no idea what kinda pressure they put on the fish when they do major flow changes like that. Right now the browns are spawning and Im sure some disruption of the spawn will happen.

Mark

Good point Mark

When you think about, most tail water systems have this same issue. People who dam water for irrigation and consumption are really only taking into consideration for the masses, not fish. I believe there should be a limit of how and when.
I did not see allot of spawning beds, but did see a couple. Mentioned to another angler and he thought I was making it up. I told him he was standing right next to a freshly cleared area for the spawn. His reply "how do you know that is what did that. I just walked away at that point... I also told a guy fishing with double treble hook rapala's on Sunday that he was now poaching and can't use that particular method. He did not realize the month had changed and actually thanked me. I have never got a response from a bait or lure chuck-er like that.

yup...
saw a lot of guys wading all over the place last time I was out there. could clearly see the beds and spawning fish.
guess they really don't know how to spot fish if they can't even spot 5 grouped spawning fish a foot from shore, where they just so happen to wade right on through.

i'm hoping to get out there mid next week.

[209er]

Hey Mark,
Good answers there. Yes, I was being a little sarcastic. Yes, I remember the kill as I was there to fish and was sickened by the sight of thousands of trout belly up. The district simply needed all the water it could get since previously it was a warm fall. I don't condon this, we had no control. crap happens. The dam is there, minimum flows are set. You can't have everything just right, you know it and I know it. More flow in the dead of winter would be nice but good luck. How would you like to be in our shoes? Needing the resource and enjoy the fishing is tough to the point of just shutting up.
On another note, it would be nice if these 'fisherman' would quit stepping all over the beds. I don't have the answer but wake up and inform your fellow sportsman. Do we really need posting? Apparently with the newer fishers, ignorance is bliss. 209er

[Rollincast]

[
09er,
Do I eat! That is a stupid question! Something that maybe an rich arrogant farmer or a drunken moron would ask. That’s the kind of attitude that has nearly wiped out our salmon and other fishery’s in California Its time that the wildlife in our state has some representation in the discussions about water uses before it is too late. If most existing dams in this state were being built today, all uses including the fish and fishing would have to be taken into account before the dam would be approved. Water stored in a reservoir is not just for farmers who get it a below market value at taxpayers and other users expense. I don’t know about the dam at Bridgeport but the government with taxpayer money built most other dams in this country. That means all other users and I should have a voice about how that water is used. Not just the landowners downstream to grow alfalfa and cows.
I have no problem with paying more for food and other items if it means that the fisheries and other wildlife in this state are protected from being left high and dry. Maybe you forgot, but the Bridgeport water Management Company was sued for creating a massive fish die off because of lack of water down stream from Bridgeport dam. And that was with a dam in place. I think that with your attitude you might want to take up some other sport. Because of your idiot statements it is obvious that you not interested in a healthy trout, salmon or steelhead fishery in this state. And I think most people on this board will agree with me.Mark

Great opening statement and conclusion, makes me want to get involved......NOT


Randy

[rickster]

If everyone on this post agree with Mark then they too are ill-informed and hypocrites.

[DubL HauL]

If everyone on this post agree with Mark then they too are ill-informed and hypocrites.

Rick why is the flow down to only 19 cfs?

Andy