Smith River

[Benny]

Is it really worth the $3000 to do a five day float trip on the Smith River in central Montana? Have any of you ever done this float? Is there any way I could just float it on my own, perhaps rent a raft and get shuttled back to my starting point?

I have been exploring the thought of doing a float trip, but the high cost are keeping me from doing it. $3000 is a huge dollar amount. If I could save the extra buck and do the float on my own for way less money, that would be awesome.

Also are there any other river that are as scenic as the Smith that one can do multi day float trips that will not be over a class I-III rapids?

Any suggestion would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

[beachbum]

If you like to be pampered and catching big fish, it's not a bad deal. 3 grand goes a long ways for a week of fishing. There's so much good water up that way.

[midger]

Benny,
I don't know about the Smith per se, but it may be a restricted river requiring permits to run it, much like the Middle Fork of the Salmon in Idaho. You have to put in for a permit during December and January for a MFS permit. They hold a raffle in March. Your odds of getting a permit are slim, maybe 1 in 20 or so. No permit? No running the river on your own. You also have to give them specific dates for put on and take off.

You can go with a commercial outfitter for around that $3000 rate, and they don't seem to have any permit issues in running these PUBLIC waters. Funny, eh? I've tried to get a permit twice, and didn't get a permit either time. OBTW, you have to file a nonrefundable application fee for each days requested as the put on date. You can file under additional names, but you have to provide the permit for each application, and supposedly, they check names to insure that the name drawn is actually on the float. I'd thought about applying under my name, daughter's names, Mother's name, etc to increase my odds, but that puts a fly in the ointment.

[Benny]

I found a bit more info on the permits required to float the Smith on this site here Smith River Floating Permits

It does seem like none of the float operations/guide services have any problems in getting the permits, they all have dates posted and some dates are already booked, go figure

It does look like a great river to spend 5 days on, between fly fishing and just soaking in the spectacular views and wildlife.

[Rockstar Fisherman]

I floated the Madison, it was a one day trip. But I was a newbie and our rafter guide was not much of a fisherman, thus I only ended up with one beautiful 15" bow.

I thought it was a cool trip, never ever would've guessed that the Madison contains any white water what so ever but it does have some, I didn't think it was anything spectacular but apparantly for Montana it is. Not really all the scenic though, but I saw TONs of trout swimming away from the raft once the river flattened out. I was much younger back then so I don't remember exactly where we put in etc. Oh and we one the float so it was free.

[NorcalBob]

I did it many moons ago before it became a "permit required" river. And Mike is right-getting a permit is not easy and outfitters are "guaranteed permits" on prime dates while you have to enter the lottery and take your chances . A very nice float with some very good fishing.
But for that kind of money I'd rather go to Alaska!!!!!

[Sasha]

Benny,
<snip> much like the Middle Fork of the Salmon in Idaho.</snip>

What I never heard of such a river Oh wait yea I have the fishing sucks on it though, plus there are lots of wolfs, bears, mountain lions, and rattle snakes.

[Benny]

It's a really tough choice deciding where to go and how much to spend. I would really like to try one of the multi day float trips though. I'm looking at a late June date, the big deal breaker is having to spend so much cash for a float trip.

The Middle Fork of the Salmon in Idaho looks really nice as well, I would have to read a little more into it and see if the prices are a little less steep than the Smith float.

I would love to go to Alaska, but it's just not going to happen this year. Perhaps with a bit more planning and maybe get a group of guys who would want to head up there together would be great.

[Benny]

The best person you could run this by is David (TheFlyGuide). After all, he grew up in Montana and has fished/guided a LOT of that state.

Yeah David would be a good person to talk to about a multi day float. The floats I was looking at are a 5 a day 60 miles on the Smith and a 5-6 day Middle Fork of the Salmon in Idaho. Both trips seem like it would be loads of fun. I am leaning more toward the Idaho float since it is longer and seems to have a bit more of an adventurous look to it with some cool rapids.

[midger]

Benny,
You can't go wrong with the Salmon and if the snow levels stay like they are now, it should be floatable (not too high) in
late June. .There are hot springs to soak in at a couple of the camping spots, it has great dry fly cutthroat fishing, and is a drop dead river. Lot's of whitewater also.

Now if you wanted to make a run on your own, you could run the main salmon from Whitebird down to the confluence of the salmon/snake. It is easier to get a permit and doable with proper arrangements--ie shuttles of cars, set up of jet boat pickup, etc. I've ran that before as well as the Snake from *'s Canyon down to the confluence. If you do that one, you arrange for the jet boat to pick you up at the sand bar at the confluence and Jet you back upriver on the Snake to either Pittsburg Landing or all the way to *'s Canyon Dam area. The Snake is harder to get a permit for (unless you are an outfitter). Te Snake is a large river--ie flows of over 10000 cfs, but it does have some nice class IV rapids, like wild sheep, granite, etc. I preferred the fishing on the salmon though and it is a smaller, more intimate river, but it also has some nice rapids.

I wouldn't recommend running either river on your own unless you are proficient rowing a raft. While not overly technical, they do demand the ability to pick your drift lines and to move your boats to avoid wrapping boulder, rocks, and sweepers.

I've not run the Smith, but I'd still opt for the MFS. Just my .03

[Flyjunkie]

Oh... I thought this Thread was about the Smith River here in California.. with it's giant race of Steelhead.... Nevermind....

[NorcalBob]

Well, to put things into perspective, if I went to the Smith and the biggest fish I caught was a 24" trout, I'd be ecstatic and call that epic fishing. If I went to the Kenai and the biggest fish I caught was a 24" trout, I'd be * and say that the fishing sucked!!!!
Both trips cost about the same!!!!!

[Benny]

Bob, what outfitter are you using to do the float trip out in Alaska? You've got my attention if it's the same price as floating the Smith or the Salmon.

[midger]

If you are going for the fish size, Alaska wins. The fish are large on the Kenai, but be prepared for combat style fishing--ie, lots of people. You can arrange for your own float, however, which gets you away from the crowds. We did one using TriRiver Charters out of Talkeetna that took us 8 days. We didn't see any other people or rafts/scanoes until we got down near the takeout and our jetboat pickup. We put on at Moose Creek, floated to the Deshka then into the Suisitna. Had a jet boat pick us up and jet us upriver to a takeout and had Tririvers take us back to Taalkeetna. We stayed at the Swiss Alaska Lodge on the outbound leg, and upon our return to Talkeetna. You can ship your gear to TriRivers before you arrive so that it is ready to pick up once you arrive from Anchorage. We used FedEx to prepostion gear. The float is nice--all class 1 and 2 (very few of these) and doable in scanoes which we rented from TriRivers. You won't see many folks, but the float isn't as scenic as the Idaho Floats, but the fish are much larger. A large MFS fish will be 15 inches with large ones being 17-18 inches.

Email me if you want more info.

[midger]

Benny, I sent you some more detailed info.