Optimal Flows

[jazz on the fly]

I looked up at the realtime flows listed at the top of the forum and I realized that I really don't know how to use any of that information. What would be the optimal flow range for the waters listed above? Also, what might one consider the high and low points rendering the waters basically unfishable?

[fflutterffly]

I'd call 100 perfect for the O, UP Kern for me is around 300 cfs to 500, e.W. 75-100 (depends on what seciton.)
What do you all think?

[lucfish]

I'd call 100 perfect for the O, UP Kern for me is around 300 cfs to 500, e.W. 75-100 (depends on what seciton.)
What do you all think?

I don't know about the Kern, but 100 is good for me on the O. Could be a little more, but that'll work fine. The Walker I prefer 250 or so. Most people don't like flows that high but its better for the fishery, it spreads the fish out and also the fishermen.

[209er]

Most of us live on this side of the Sierra Nevadas and this is big. And the subject is optimal flows and fishing in general? I may get whacked BUT we need more storage! Let that soak in a minute. Yes that means more dams BUT what do you fish behind? Think about it. It may already be a moot point with the rivers in question but you just wait. Soon the Army Corps Of Engineers or whoever controls the dams(yes I'm playing a little dumb)will open up the flows to (God help us) make room for the spring runoff!!!!!!Especially this year. If Temperance Dam and Rodgers Crossing Dam was in place they wouldn't have to do that. Sure it's expensive and will rarely be used normally but! More water(?) means more cool summer time flows, IF you want to look at it that way. You just can't keep thinking NO. Sure everybody wants a pristine river but with todays closures, it's called moving forward. Salmon, steelhead, stripers, and trout suffer from dams but hey you drink water too! Eat too! I remember one quote earlier on this forum and I'm not singling anyone out but he said "we have plenty of water, let's desalinize(sp) the ocean". Sooner or later it will be that way cost or not. You think you're paying high now, wait. 209er

[FlyinFish]

Most of us live on this side of the Sierra Nevadas and this is big. And the subject is optimal flows and fishing in general? I may get whacked BUT we need more storage! Let that soak in a minute. Yes that means more dams BUT what do you fish behind? Think about it. It may already be a moot point with the rivers in question but you just wait. Soon the Army Corps Of Engineers or whoever controls the dams(yes I'm playing a little dumb)will open up the flows to (God help us) make room for the spring runoff!!!!!!Especially this year. If Temperance Dam and Rodgers Crossing Dam was in place they wouldn't have to do that. Sure it's expensive and will rarely be used normally but! More water(?) means more cool summer time flows, IF you want to look at it that way. You just can't keep thinking NO. Sure everybody wants a pristine river but with todays closures, it's called moving forward. Salmon, steelhead, stripers, and trout suffer from dams but hey you drink water too! Eat too! I remember one quote earlier on this forum and I'm not singling anyone out but he said "we have plenty of water, let's desalinize(sp) the ocean". Sooner or later it will be that way cost or not. You think you're paying high now, wait. 209er

Dude, that is a humongous can of worms and has nothing to do with what optimal flows are for fishing conditions...

[Rockstar Fisherman]

Most of us live on this side of the Sierra Nevadas and this is big. And the subject is optimal flows and fishing in general? I may get whacked BUT we need more storage! Let that soak in a minute. Yes that means more dams BUT what do you fish behind? Think about it. It may already be a moot point with the rivers in question but you just wait. Soon the Army Corps Of Engineers or whoever controls the dams(yes I'm playing a little dumb)will open up the flows to (God help us) make room for the spring runoff!!!!!!Especially this year. If Temperance Dam and Rodgers Crossing Dam was in place they wouldn't have to do that. Sure it's expensive and will rarely be used normally but! More water(?) means more cool summer time flows, IF you want to look at it that way. You just can't keep thinking NO. Sure everybody wants a pristine river but with todays closures, it's called moving forward. Salmon, steelhead, stripers, and trout suffer from dams but hey you drink water too! Eat too! I remember one quote earlier on this forum and I'm not singling anyone out but he said "we have plenty of water, let's desalinize(sp) the ocean". Sooner or later it will be that way cost or not. You think you're paying high now, wait. 209er

Dude, that is a humongous can of worms and has nothing to do with what optimal flows are for fishing conditions...

Uh Totally!!!

For fishing purposes, I like the Upper Kern from 1000 on down, I've fished it when it's clear at 1400 and had great sucess but it's hard. My limit for the upper Kern is 2000. Now for the EW anywhere from 250 on down, since I've never fished it nor seen it when it's higher, it may fish just fine at 350 IDK. Now for the Lower Owens, anywhere from 250 on down, 300 might even be good but most people don't want to work that hard there. The Upper Owens doens't change enough to where I'd think twice about fishing, and I rarely do but that's besides the point.

[fly addict]

EW and the LO are good at 200/250. That flow on the LO will limit where you can cross and keep you from getting to a few places. But it spreads the fish out in to water that at 100 they won't be there. Same with the EW, but the wading is not as hard, you just have to be careful where you go. Carry a good wading stick with you. The LO at current flows (100) has most of the fish stacked up in the deeper water until a hatch goes off. I won't fish the EW at the winter flow of 23 cfs. The fish are really bunched up into the deeper slots; you can snag fish with a big heavy lure if you are so minded. I think the EW should be closed to fishing when the river gets below 75 cfs. Give the fish the winter off, They get hammered every day from early spring till late fall. The Upper Owens does not change a whole lot throughout the year. It is a spring creek for the most part. I have not seen it become unfishable. The Kern is always good at anything less than 1000. It gets way to hot and crowded in the middle of summer.

Mark

[fflutterffly]

I'm sorry I miss understood the post. Are we speaking of how we like to fish the water or optimal for the fish? Are you looking for scientific information or what's easy for whatever age you are.

And... as for 209... We'd have enough water without growing lawns in deserts. Learn to play golf with very large traps by cutting the course grass down to 1/2. And if you must have grass in the desert, shorten the course to three par but with difficult holes for the challenge. Why not mandate Xeriscaping, which will remove the water restrictions... Cuz you hardly have to water!
That way we will have enough to drink... for the time being anyway.
I am not for river dams. Look at the Smith. Or maybe we should look at self imposed population control a little closer. It is a can of worms and I'm just not smart enough to think about it other than from a visceral point of view.

[lucfish]

I won't fish the EW at the winter flow of 23 cfs. The fish are really bunched up into the deeper slots; you can snag fish with a big heavy lure if you are so minded. I think the EW should be closed to fishing when the river gets below 75 cfs. Give the fish the winter off, They get hammered every day from early spring till late fall. Mark

Amen