Dry Fly Rie wrote: Sounds like we need a flood of Biblical proportions to sweep through the canyon and wipe out all of the dams and human effects.
csimcox wrote:Not to mention the laziness of people that can't carry out the things they carried in. It's amazing where you'll find trash in that canyon.
Flatsix wrote:...Arrest people for starting fires, arrest them for building dams, arrest them for shooting guns, arrest them for crapping on the rocks, arrest them for throwing diapers in the creek, impound vehicles illegally parked vehicles etc. I realize that it'll push them elsewhere but just keep the pressure on until they finally get it.
DrCreek wrote:Flatsix wrote:...Arrest people for starting fires, arrest them for building dams, arrest them for shooting guns, arrest them for crapping on the rocks, arrest them for throwing diapers in the creek, impound vehicles illegally parked vehicles etc. I realize that it'll push them elsewhere but just keep the pressure on until they finally get it.
Sorry in advance, but now my blood is running hard. Not at you FlatSix, just the idea of it all.
And risk exactly what for trying to arrest them? A beating like that ranger got last year? Maybe a cop murder or two? That's how they prefer to solve these issues - with violence. It's what they do best and all they know. That's how they strike fear in the rest of us that are stuck looking in while shaking our heads in disgust. I would NEVER expect any single resource ranger and/or police officer to go up against these people by themselves. It's a no-win gig.
It sounds great and very Kumbaya'ish to think that a little verbal direction, some hand-holding and a group hug will make everything okay up there. It's won't. Nobody here is part of that world. To them, we're just * and intruders on their weekend picnic grounds, and we deserve to have our asses kicked and our cars vandalized just for thinking we can drive into that trailhead parking lot. It's not everyone's playground anymore - it's theirs.
Even though I agree that something (obviously) has to be done to ensure future preservation, reality (should) tell you there is nothing definite that can be done. Other than shutting the place down to the public altogether by closing all the roads with gates and locks at the bottom (which will constantly get vandalized anyway because now you've * ALL of them off), there are no real alternatives.
This is how it is... These people "get it." They just choose to be that way because it's easy and there's really no one that's going to stand up to them, hold them accountable and tell them any different. If these people want an "education," they'll ask for one. And I don't know of anyone that's ever walked up to someone else and said, "Show me how to do it the right way." Confronting someone will only end in hurt feelings and a busted lip - or worse.
There is NO respect for laws or badged officials from that group, so how could we in our wildest dreams expect police officers or rangers to get in there and tidy things up? These people could care less about the laws or any enforcement official, or about what anyone else thinks. It's time to start looking at this with eyes wide open and realize that its never going to be the way it used to be. It's 2012. Reality is a *.
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