Yearly Trip (ALASKA)

[Artin]

Hi Guys,

So a couple of friends of mine and I are looking to plan a trip this year. We sort of research on our own and come to the table with a location, fish, how and when. This is the first time in a few that I will actually be able to go. Then we take a vote. This year I am trying to get an Alaska trip in. I have always wanted to go there and fish. It's a long time dream on my bucket list that has eluded me the for many years.

So I am asking for some help. I have no idea where to begin, Alaska is so VAST. I do know that I will propose the south east or south west. Looking to maximize the species and get into some rainbows, grayling and dollies (hopefully) along with salmon.

We are on a budget (at least me) so a lodge is out of the question. I have looked into renting an RV and just hitting the road. I also came across some info on US Forrest Service cabins we can rent as well. I had no idea this type of accommodation existed. They look pretty cool.

Any particular rivers I should look into? What can I expect form Alaska? Flies? there are a ton out there but first hand experience hopefully could help me more than the generic fly fisherman magazine article

PM me if you'd prefer.

Thanks in advance for the advice.

Artin

[NorcalBob]

A couple of things to think about......
Alaska is very large and diverse and difficult to describe in one short conversation.
Budget (AK can be very $$$$), species you want to catch, time of year (relates to species), locations, and "wilderness experience" factor are all questions you need to examine.
Budget: If you are on a tight budget (not able to spend $3,000 ++++ a week), the roadside network is your only real option. The Kenai Peninsula has a fantastic array of roadside waters easily accessible via RV (rent in Anchorage)(I highly recommend this option). The Forest Service Cabin route is also fairly inexpensive (by AK standards) but has important things to consider. The RV route would cost about $1,000-$1,500 a week per person (not counting airfare).
Species: Want a salmon? Trout? Other? Big fish/Quantity? Don't say all of them in the same trip, best fishing times depend on your target species.
Time of year: Depends on species!
Locations: Depends on time of year and species!
"Wilderness" factor: AK fishing can be "combat" fishing with tons of people, or less so.
I would recommend deciding on your budget and then working from there.
If you go the roadside route, I recommend two books, 1) Flyfishers Guide To Alaska, Scott Haugen; 2) The Alaska Roadside Anglers Guide, Gunnar Pedersen (in this book you just might see my name a few times!)
Search the archives here for some of my Alaska trip reports.
I will close with a bit of sage advice from a long time Alaska angler: Alaska can be the best fishing you ever could imagine and it could also be some of the worst fishing you ever could imagine!

[WanderingBlues]

Man, I can't wait to follow this as it develops. Good on ya Artin.

[NorcalBob]

I recommend you start here:
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=6594&hilit=+alaska
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4554&hilit=+alaska
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4557&hilit=+alaska
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=3499&hilit=+alaska
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=2326&hilit=+alaska
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=2234&hilit=+alaska

[Artin]

Thanks Bob,
Thanks for the links, this will make it easier for me to continue reading. We had guests last night and I started late, I did the search last night and started reading on your Alaska posts till I fell asleep.
So looks like prime time is in Sept. and the place to be is the Kenai?
I'm really intrigued with that albino char and those FAT bows!! Amazing fish.
I have also been on the Alaska fish and game site reading up here.

http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm?adfg=fishing.main

http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm?adfg=ByAreaSouthcentralKodiak.alaskapeninsula

If I were to go for King's, I'd have to time in between June and August. That's in the Peninsula. Little or no road access. Would this apply to the Kenai as well? If so, then would the Rainbows/Steelhead, Char also be up and about?


Where is this?
http://www.flyfishingaddicts.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=2326&hilit=+alaska
There are two different streams it looks like. Wow!

Budget wise... I was thinking about $1,500.00 without flights. But I could push it up a tad bit to get away from crowds.

I feel like I'm kinda all over the place here. Is this normal?

Curtis, I can't wait. I think with the right kinda umph I can pull this vote through. I do know that Pike and Muskie in the midwest is also on the list of one of my friends.... But I'm all for Alaska this trip!

Artin

[NorcalBob]

I thought about maybe just doing the PM route on this subject with Artin, but there may be some general interest in this subject matter, and AK should be on everyone's bucket list, so I'll continue it through this thread. I apologize in advance if I'm boring any one!
<<<So looks like prime time is in Sept. and the place to be is the Kenai?>>><<<Budget wise... I was thinking about $1,500.00 without flights. But I could push it up a tad bit to get away from crowds>>>
I've been fishing AK since the 1980's, all over the entire state, and IMNSHO, if you want a cheap AK trip, there is no better place to be than the Kenai Peninsula in early-mid SEPT. It's a diverse fishery, with lots of quality fish, and easily accessible. With a budget of around $1500, you are pretty much restricted to the road network, and that leaves the: 1) Anchorage area (Kenai Peninsula and MatSu valley), 2)Kodiak Island, and 3) Southeast (mainly Ketchikan and PWI). However, I will be very upfront about the roadside waters, they are very popular fisheries and you will be seeing lots of people. If you want a "real" wilderness experience, you will have to spend a lot more money than $1500 and even then it's not easy to get away from crowds.
<<<If I were to go for King's, I'd have to time in between June and August. That's in the Peninsula. Little or no road access. Would this apply to the Kenai as well? If so, then would the Rainbows/Steelhead, Char also be up and about?>>>
King runs are in the toilet and at this time I would NOT recommend a king focused trip to any roadside waters. Especially if your focus is fly fishing. For rainbows/steelhead and char I would recommend early-mid-SEP as that time offers better fishing opportunites than king time.
<<<Where is this?>>>
Somewhere on the Kenai Peninsula (and yes, those are road accessible waters!)! If you decide to go I'd be more than happy to discuss specific locations, etc. via PM's and help you plan your trip.
<<<I feel like I'm kinda all over the place here. Is this normal?>>>
Yep, AK is a huge expansive state with very diverse fishing opportunities. It's hard to describe in just one conversation.
Any more questions, just LMK!

[briansII]

Good for you Artin! Should be a blast with your buddies. I remember the planning nights with friends were an enjoyable(food, drink & cigars) part of the trip.

I cannot add to what Bob has said, other than I did an "affordable" trip several years ago. We shopped around and found a fly in camp. Cost back then was around $1,400, plus our airfare. The following year or two, the cost were about 50% off because they had open spots to fill. I doubt you can find something that cheap now, but if you are able to do a lot of research, you might find a hidden bargain. Always prudent to checkout the credentials of any outfitter/guide before booking.

Another option is to do a wilderness float. I have friends who have been doing these for several years. Fly in, get dropped off(no guide, just your group) with gear and raft, and picked up 5-7 days later downriver. This is not for everyone, but if you like "roughing it", this offers excellent fishing for multiple species.....and solitude up the wazoo. PM me if you want info on this type of trip.

briansII

[BrownBear]

I'd narrow it down to your top choices in species, then look at the timing required and best area. You can spend your whole week just traveling around in a frazzle with very little fishing, if you're not careful. If I recall correctly the ADF&G site has some great graphics on species timing.

After that it becomes a question of access and your tolerance for crowds. The easier a place is to get to, the more people you'll have. And the harder a place is to reach, the more you're going to spend (and the more time required) to get there.

For a sense of scale, realize that the cartographers always shrink the scale of AK to help it fit on the same page with the rest of the US. In actual fact, the distance from one end of the state to the other is comparable to the distance between Seattle and Miami, or between Seattle and Mexico City depending on how you twist the map. Up until the politicians got to playing games, we used to have 4 time zones in the state. Now we only have 2.

[Artin]

Bob,
So I went ahead of schedule and pitched Alaska, Kenai to be exact. This trip won the vote! We will be heading out to Alaska this year

I do have a bunch of questions though. Where to begin. I will be booking flights soon and get that out of the way.
Looked into RV rentals and they are very reasonable.
We do want some salmon action so based on your recommendation of timing in early to mid Sept. Looks like there will be Silver Salmon out and about during that time. I'd like to talk over PM's if you're ok with it regarding some specifics to get a better understanding of how to plan this thing out. We would be flying into Anchorage. Memorial weekend falls on Sept. 7th. So I would like to avoid it at all costs and either go before or after.

Thanks Brains,
Although I think that those kinds of trips are a little out of my league for me at this point. I would love to hear about them for a possible future trip.
PM sent.

BB,
I know what you're talking about about the maps being decieving. I checked and a drive from Anchorage to Soldonta is almost 3 hours. Sure does NOT look this way on a map.
Unfortunately my tolerance for crowds is limited. Mostly because I've run into some * on the Kern and Bishop area which blew my mind when it came to politeness and common decency. I am limited on my options for solitude if any with the road system, but if I can at least get away from those epic pictures I have seen where there are people lined up the banks every 5 or 6 feet I would be ok with it.


Artin

[BrownBear]

Dunno the Kenai all that well, but by waiting until after Labor Day weekend, you'll really thin the crowds- especially on weekdays.

For the best possible info on the Kenai, get hold of Mike at Mossy's Fly Shop in Anchorage. He's the ultimate in good guys, and all the better Kenai guides hang out in his shop, along with a bunch of other top-notch local fly fishers. He'll give you the straightest of the strait scoop.

One little detail. Dunno about timing and open seasons, but the Kenai has some bruiser rainbows in it. Big water and big fish. Only place I know where a 7WT rod is probably too light for trout. Got my clock cleaned once by a 30"+ rainbow (estimated) while fishing an 8WT for silvers. Pretty good estimate though, because my pardner had just landed a 28" version, and mine was lots bigger. Jumped twice up close, zipped off over 100 yards of backing downstream, and broke my 12# leader when it turned upstream. Yeah. Bring a little nitro to calm your heart after one of those guys!

[NorcalBob]

<<<Looked into RV rentals and they are very reasonable>>>
Yep, not much more expensive than a rental car (except for the gas bill!)! I recommend Great Alaska Holidays RV, and they are the outfit I've always dealt with. The big benefit of the RV is you are not fixed to one location. There are plenty of places to camp out in your RV any where you go in AK, it is a very RV friendly state. This is mobility is important, because at the time of the year you're going the fish move around quite a bit following the spawning salmon and you have to be mobile. Which leads to me to AK fishing tip #1, find the spawning salmon and you will find plenty of rainbows and dollies nearby! If you're fishing somewhere and you don't see spawning salmon, move some where else!
<<<Memorial (Labor Day!) weekend falls on Sept. 7th. So I would like to avoid it at all costs and either go before or after>>>
Good plan! I fished Labor Day once, and I will never do it again! Combat fishing at it's finest! Before Labor Day is better for silver salmon on the coastal streams, but it's very crowded then. After Labor Day is better for trout/dollies/silver salmon on the interior streams and is far less crowded. Take your pick!
<<<Looks like there will be Silver Salmon out and about during that time>>>
Prime time for silvers on the Cook Inlet streams (Deep Creek and Anchor River) is mid-AUG to early SEPT. On the interior streams (Kenai & Russian) prime time is from mid-SEP onwards. Take your pick! Steelhead are also available from early SEP onwards.
<<<Unfortunately my tolerance for crowds is limited>>>
While the Kenai Peninsula offers fantastic fishing and offers a great deal of bang for the buck, it is a VERY CROWDED and popular fishery. Big fish and easy access is what everyone wants. There, I've warned you! In some places you can walk a bit to lessen the crowds, but you will likely experience combat fishing at some places no matter what.
I also recommend a float with a guide on the Middle Kenai River (Skilak to Bings). Quite pricey, but I'd at least spring for at least one day, and if it fits your budget more days. The biggest rainbows in Alaska (that includes everywhere!) are found in this stretch of the Kenai. I second BB's recommendation to contact Mossy's Fly Shop for guide info. You need a boat to fish this stretch as there is virtually no public walk-in access. But, WARNING, it is a very popular (and crowded) fishery!
I highly recommend you get the book Flyfisher's Guide to Alaska by Scott Haugen. It will be the best $30 you ever spent! It has maps and details for all the Kenai Peninsula streams and all the info you need to know. Get the book!!!!! Once you get the book PM me and I'll fill you in on all the secret details not mentioned! But you'll need the book to see exactly where I'm talking about.

[mike.s]

When i saw your post my first thought was Bob... Glad he chimed. Ive done 10 trips all over Alaska and my last trip was last summer. Ditto to everything bob said. Its an expensive place but good planning and tons of research will help a lot to understanding costs and whats out there. The internet is your friend.. lol. For your first trip kenai should be fun but make no mistake its the most crowded place to fish in Alaska and is not always loaded with fish. Ive had great days there and some of my worse too.. So You think the kern and bishop is combat fishing?..Lol. Kenai is combat fishing to da max but can still be a fun place. With some research and i will pm you too, there is a few areas on the peninsular that are a little less crowded but not much. There is also a few good char/dolly fishing streams in that area that can be less crowded and fun too. I personally like the middle Kenai for big rainbows in mid to late sept in a drift boat. Bob has done the same thing too. Good luck.

[NorcalBob]

<<<Ive had great days there and some of my worse too>>>
Welcome to the club Mike! Been there done that!

[midger]

I'm a Johnny come lately to this thread, but if it's tranquility without crowds, I'd recommend a self guided float trip. We did one using Tri River Charters out of Talkeetna. We spent 9 days floating various rivers (all the same trip, but one river flowed into another bigger river, etc). At the end of the float we'd arranged for a jet boat to pick us up and take us back to the landing where transportation took us back to Talkeetna. We put in on Moose Creek and floated and camped along the rivers for the whole trip. We didn't see another party for the entire trip and we caught salmon. grayling, and rainbows--actually got tired of eating BBQ salmon by about day 4.

We floated using scanoes (square butted canoes) with 2 persons to a scanoe. We had a party of 6. cost was reasonable but you have to be a good planner/logistician to make sure you take everything you need because there are no stores out there--nothing actually but bear, moose, beaver and other assorted critters. The wagonmaster for our trip had done numerous trips so Charlie keeps a couple of 12 gauge shotguns at TriRivers, and we FedExed our gear directly to TriRivers to make sure it was available when we arrived. We filled our grocery list in Anchorage before driving to Talkeetna. We made this trip in late July and with the exception of rain every day, had a great time and landed lots of fish. Fortunately we weren't accosted by any bear and the moose kept their distance (so did we). The grayling were a nice touch for me as I'd not caught one of these before. The rivers we transited didn't require major river paddling skills--nothing higher than Class II, but it definitely helps if you are familiar with reading water so you can avoid strainers, sweepers, etc. Not any AAA wreckers out in the wild so you have to be self sufficient.

[Artin]

Brown Bear I checked out Mossy's and looks like i will definitely be a stop for us. A day with a guide isn't a bad idea at all. Thanks for that tip. The rainbows in the Kenai are a target for me actually. I hope I get to feel one of those guys on the other end of my line. Bows that big are pretty old I read. Strong and well fed. About those rods... I am missing a couple. So I have a 7wt which is too light and next one up is a 10, nothing in between. So I'm either out gunned or overkill....

Bob,
I was on their site a few days ago. Very nice and new (2015) RV's. I went through the entire rental process to see what the actual cost would be and it's very reasonable. They do have an option for $49.00 to guarantee if the prices go down you will pay the lower rate..
"Low Rate Guarantee: I would always like the lower Rate: Between now and my Pickup day, if the Rate goes down, Great Alaskan Holidays will adjust my Rate to the new lower Rate, excluding Odds & Ends and Promotional Vouchers. If the Rate goes up, Great Alaskan Holidays will keep my Rate at the lowest Rate that was available between the date and time I made my reservation and my Pickup day. There is a $49.95 service fee for this option. more"
Do you reccomend this?

We are actually going to go after the 7th. Spoke with the guys and they are good with it. So we will be fishing the interior streams.
I will also look into getting a guide, at least one day. I saw that you fished with the same guide often. If I recall correctly his name is Mike? Could you give me his info. I'd prefer to go with someone who you guys know.

I went ahead and ordered the Fly Fishers Guide to Alaska you recommended. I should have it in a few days. I can't wait. I'm so excited about going. Can't wait till september.

Also, Note taken. I will share the rivers on the Kenai with half the US Salmon Fishing Population.

I will prepare myself mentally fgor this challenge and be victorious!

Mike,
Thanks for chiming in I appreciate it. I hear ya on the good and bad days of fishing. But I can tell you that any day fishing is better than not. I have gotten skunked. MANY times. And would take a skunk over not fishing any day of the week and twice on Sundays.
I am doing research for sure. I need all the info I can get. I want to make sure that I don't go unprepared and be that guy Brown Bear said, about spending my week traveling instead of fishing. That would not be cool.

Thank you all again for taking your time an chiming in. This is very cool of you I am very thankful!

Artin